Red Light Q’s

If given red light from pack creation and you’ve already gotten a following of wolves and other chars IC, in the meantime of wait, what is there to do? Confirmed as an Unofficial Group, what do you do during the wait time until reapplication?

It's important that a prospective pack applies and receives a green light before doing any IC formation:

Step 1: If you're thinking of starting a pack, please fill out the following form with your prospective pack information, then submit it to the community managers using the account that will be involved in founding the pack. Do this before proceeding with your plans IC!

Source: https://wolf-rpg.com/showthread.php?tid=8345

It's entirely up to you how to explain the IC delay!

I mean if it’s gonna be considered an unofficial group due to lack of members anyway, why is it red lighted is another question? I’ve read on the not-doing-anything-IC bit; just wondering because of lack of membership. I thought it woulda been wiser to atleast try to accumulate members before submitting the app because of the new number rule. I think last time I tried making the pack, it was a different member count in 2016? I could be wrong. And that time it got red lighted from too much carryover from Godfather fiction.

**DISCLAIMER**

NOT trying to sound hostile or abrasive or w/e, honest. It’s just curiosity and a questions.

I thought it woulda been wiser to atleast try to accumulate members before submitting the app because of the new number rule.

This goes directly against the required process outlined in the Guidebook as quoted above. You skipped a critical step in the process. Although we wish it could be a purely IC process, there are some essential reasons we have to manage parts of it OOC.

We red-lit you to enforce the steps, which you need to follow in the proper order. Sorry, them's the rules!

Another Q- 

why did is it a pre-make OC thing to ask ahead of IC making? Well, not necessarily making, but like the gathering of ideas and attempts? Do you all put up a warning of there being too many packs or something else that would stop a pack from being made? Or is that one of the reasons people make the app first?

And that other one didn’t get answered. I understand it’s a violation and all the starting IC part, but we wouldn’t have enough to make it a pack anyways- what’s the point of the redlight if even after we would still be considered an Unofficial Group? Especially if we’re just gonna be unofficial group-ing until we get the number of people to join between time of red notif  and end of it? It would still be the same circumstance.

The reason people submit the app first is because it's a requirement. There's a few reasons for this, some of which are covered here: https://wolf-rpg.com/showthread.php?tid=8345

We've had this process a while now and we feel it strikes a good balance for the game (and its management).

We could not green light your pack's app or it would be unfair to those who follow the procedure. The only other option was a red light, partly as a reminder to make sure you're familiar with and following game policy.

The point of red lighting or green lighting is so that CMs can eyeball prospective packs and make sure that everyone involved has their ducks in order before starting formation. if we let threads that took place before CM-approval be used for formation threads, it negates the point of having red/green lighting in the first place. The red/green lighting is also intended to time-gate people from making flash-in-the-pan packs that fizz out in a matter of weeks, or packs that are incompatible with our guidelines or game.

This motion was largely set into place by player feedback, as we had several packs form and then rapidly die out, which lead to some OOC disappointment. Players have voiced that they want packs with established characters and established longevity over packs that rapidly rise and fall. The red/green lighting of the rules helps enforce this.

That being said I think I understand where the confusion is coming from. The Pack Formation clause in the GB details that green lighting must take place before official formation threads can begin. Players can collect members and organically pursue avenues ICly that lead to unofficial groupings prior to CM approval (example being Saltwinter), but none of those threads can be used / qualify towards the ten required threads for official pack formation.

I believe in the PM the ten threads referenced were for pack creation, which does go against our guidelines in the GB, as you must obtain CM approval before you can make the ten threads that go towards Offical Pack formation.

Once your pack does get greenlit, you can then start the ten threads required for official formation. But you cannot use threads posted prior to the CM approval, even if you backdate or forward date them.

Okay, I see it’s a requirement. 

and I see there is an explaination to numbers, if the game could handle another pack, and if it was borrowing too heavily from other fiction, along with whether the chars that were involved at the right post count. 

Im still asking why it’s a rule for the unofficial group to receive a red light though, if there’s still another level it has to go through before it’s actually completely approved. And why that rule had come to be. I’m just saying since like what had come together hadn’t been anything that claimed to be an actual pack; it was just a group of wolves that had begun to settle in the woods.

OOOOHHHH okay I get it. The method got mixed up then; shouldn’t have sent the threads or else it would seem like I just threw forward a pack outta nowhere without hitting that step one, okay!! Now That makes sense- thanks a lot. I know now. 

So only after the app it becomes mandatory; it’s not just a so-Do thing that the threads are sent to y’all since that leads to believe it’s claiming to be a pack.

So are there qualifications for being labeled an Unofficial Group? Are there like requirements for it, or does it have any negative holdings to becoming an actual pack should an app be put forth and accepted? Because if so, can that be forsaken to try again after the 30 days?

Correct. The PM sent to us was "Shadewood Pack Formation," with 10 threads. For violating procedure, the 30 days was incurred.

We don't police unofficial groups and will review any future formal apps against the criteria in the Guidebook, nothing else.

Ah Mhmnk, cool. So should there be anything to note/do between/before the 30 days is up? I mean since it’s considered an unofficial group thing, like should there be any OOC amends/changes? Or just continue on doing the prep?

Unless policies are being violated, we really don't police these things! It's up to you how to handle IC and OOC.

I mean - 
ijustviolatedthepolicyoutofignorance 

so if you could toss me some advice so I don’t do a third stupid thing that gets this pack redlighted for the third time, that would be all the swellyjelly

Read the Guidebook! :)

Just to chime in with some crystal clarity, though this is also in the Guidebook: only threads created after receiving a green light will be counted toward the official pack formation request. It's up to you how to handle things IC between now and a potential green light, but keep in mind you will need the required threads to be dated (as in, actual posted date) after a green light is granted.

I’ve read it - I just didn’t understand it as good, it seems. That’s why I’m asking for advice. 

The first time I made Shadewood, it was akin to an Italian Mafia/Family kinda ordeal, stated as that in the bio structure, and I made sure it wasn’t a work of fiction from the research and stuffs. It got redlighted for 6 months for ‘being too much like The Godfather’ which is yes, a work of fiction, when I had originally had structure based it from Cosa Nostra, and Sicilian roots.

Just to chime in with some crystal clarity, though this is also in the Guidebook: only threads created after receiving a green light will be counted toward the official pack formation request. It's up to you how to handle things IC between now and a potential green light, but keep in mind you will need the required threads to be dated (as in, actual posted date) after a green light is granted.

So all in all, it’s better to just come out asking first before even trying to make the pack? Or can we just ask the staff if there’s room for a pack first? How many packs can the site hold? Is it based off of active player count, or is it a self-determining thing?

Just asking since I make projects like this planned out ahead of time - I don’t wanna put in this work and find out later I have to wait for [insert reason that hadn’t been found out till told] 

And that was another thing I asked; has there been a time Wolf was full up on packs? Like to where someone wanted to make one and was redlighted for there being no space?

As we've quoted several times:

Step 1: If you're thinking of starting a pack, please fill out the following form with your prospective pack information, then submit it to the community managers using the account that will be involved in founding the pack. Do this before proceeding with your plans IC!

This is outlined in our pack creation article very clearly. So, yes, we would like you to ask first before proceeding with your plans in character. We require this to prevent exactly that: we don't want you to put in the work unnecessarily.

In your case, your pack was red-lit only because you skipped this first step. We explained this when we gave the red light.

So either way I’d have to put forth some kinda work- like the app itself is outlining creativity effort, not just “hey is there room for another pack?” 

Im asking like if there was a way y’all would be able to put up a “don’t try and make a pack right this instant- we’re all full up” thingie if it ever arose so the people who would have gone through thinking up pack stuff wouldn’t invest time and stuff to send in the app.

Trying to answer these questions as they come, and hopefully clear this up 100%

1. Asking first is what the Pack Application is for –once you meet the minimum requirements (30 days longevity/50 posts), send the Pack Application in. This is done so that no unnecessary work needs to be voided/invalidated on the potential leader’s behalf – once you are green-lit, you can start the real work of formation threads.

2. The number of packs is situationally based (and closure of new packs is usually member/feedback driven) – if we do not have pack formations open, we will tell you. It will be announced in our Announcements and, will also be denoted in our Pack Creation GB.


3. WOLF has had closed pack applications in the past. When this happened, as above, it was announced in Announcements and mentioned in the GB that new pack formation was closed. You wouldn’t be able to miss it ;)

4. Regarding what to do following a red light: wait the 30 days, and apply again. Remember you cannot make threads that go towards your “formation threads” until you are Green-lit. You can continue to collect members as an unofficial group but none of those threads will count towards formation. Any thread made before you are Green Lit does not count towards the ten Formation Threads required.


5. The redlight for Shadewood Keep was due to the fact 10 formation threads were included in the PM, therefore, skipping the critical step of gaining CM approval first. Following our GB, any pack red-lit must wait 30 days to reapply – hence the 30 day restriction placed on SK’s formation.

6. The thirty day rule became a rule on WOLF because of member feedback. Too many flash-in-the-pan packs that disbanded shortly after settlement, making more work for both players and CMs oocly and causing a lot of OOC headache. Thirty days is enough time for leaders to establish longevity, collect more unofficial members, and also gives plenty of time for them to fix anything within their pack application that needs adjustment.


7. There are no requirements for Unofficial Groups. We do not police or monitor them, and we do not OOCly denote them by making new titles on WOLF. Unofficial groups are free to do whatever IC, they just will not be recognized as an official group until they complete, step-by-step our Pack Formation process which is outlined in the GB.

Trying to answer these questions as they come, and hopefully clear this up 100%

it did thank you! I’m saving this post, and writing notes, so I don’t do a stupid again. Notes from all of this, but this list helped a lot. Thanks again! Done pestering yall for now~